F1-75 - New Physics

[J.C.Case]

F1-75 - New Physics

by J.C.Case » 21 Dec 2009, 03:22

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Description:Hi folk´s!

I´ve made these new physics to the F1-Seven Full88 Mod (I´ve not used Luka´s files if anyone wonders), which I´ve called F1-75. I started out doing them just for my own sake and to see if I could, never really intended to share them with anyone more than just a few friends.

I actually didn´t even think in those term until those friends (who had driven the Mod) said that I ought too. And as the work has progressed I started to feel that it they might be right. The cars feels very nice to drive now and it would be fun if a some more people, like you guy´s here at Calluster would like to try them out too.

As I´m from Sweden and English isn´t my native language I´m having a bit of a hard time writing and expressing myself in English, so I´ll use some quotes from the ReadMe to present the Mod to you, instead of rewriting the same stuff once again which will take me hours..

Quote..
F1-75 Mod based on the F1-Seven Full 88 Mod.
----------------------------------------------------------
INFORMATION:

I´ve always wanted to drive these 70´s Formula 1 cars and when I stumbled across these two F1-75 Mods about a month ago, the F1 70´s and the F1-Seven88, I got pretty exited at first, but when I tried them out I felt a bit disappointed.

I didn´t like the feel of the "70´s" (v.3.0) physics, (I´m not saying they are bad though), and the "F1-Seven Full 88" mod uses F1-88 physics and as good as they are, they don't suit a Formula 1 car from 1975.

But I thought that instead of whining, I should try to do some new physics which were more to my own likings and I´ve done that now, and I hope you´ll like them too.
------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
CONTENT:

This F1-75 mod includes 15 teams from 1975 using 58 Cars in 24 different physics configurations. The mod also contains Sounds and Talent files, plus 4 Extra Cars outside the Championship.

All cars have the same basic physics but are differentiated by different engines, drag and height of body mass and in some cases weight, which gives them all different behaviour and performances.

The Ferrari is the fastest of them, and have a top speed of about 275 kph at Kyalami75, while the BRM only tops about 255 Kph. But the BRM has got some nice handling and will give a lot of cars a run for their money on twisty tracks.
.....
I´ve had a look at the WDC/WCC Championships while setting the performance of the cars, but I´ve also looked at starting grids/lap times and I`ve taken that into consideration too. Ex the Shadows was one of the fastest cars on the grid in 1975 even though it didn't score a lot of points during the season, which was due to a lot of break downs and some driver errors.

The cars performance starting with the fastest:

Ferrari
Brabham
McLaren (Brabham and Mclaren uses the same physics)
Shadows
Hesketh
Tyrrell
Lotus (Works team)
March (751)
Parnelli
Williams
Penske
Lotus (privateers)
Ensign
Surtees
Hill-Ford
BRM
Hill-Lola
Copersucar
-------
The Ferrari is about 2.5s a lap faster than the slowest 75 cars at Kyalami75, lapping around at 1.12.6xx (with me behind the wheel), while the BRM and CopersucarFD1 are lapping in the 1.15.0xx range.

The Brabham and McLaren are a little bit slower than the Ferrari (just as they where in 1975) but not by much, just by a whisker. And as the Ferrari is a little bit trickier to drive, they´re almost equal in performance over a lap.

The default setups are made for Kyalami75, but they should work on most tracks with a little bit of tweaking, (they work really well @ Oesterreichring(70) right out of the box too, btw).

They are a little bit understeary to suit me, I´m driving very much on throttle pointing the nose of the car by spinning the rear´s a bit thrue the corners, but it´s easy to dial out if you want to.
...........
The physics are very much a "seat of the pants" thing, developed by me using toe-heel on a 3-pedal system and a H-shifter after watching a lot of early 70´s Formula 1 videos, and I think that the cars handles pretty much like they did back then. As most other people I've never driven one, but one can have some perception or idea of how it would be anyway.

The cars are very nice to drive now, but they are not meant to be easy to drive though (it´s Formula 1 cars ffs). This is not "full throttle racing" so to speak, and you´ll have to manipulate the throttle thrue the corners using fine tuned throttle application on the limit.
....
The cars are a bit too fast on Kya75 and Zandy67, but very close to the times they once set @ Silverstone(79) and Oesterreichring(70), and they are far too slow on tracks with low grip levels like Gpc Monza75/79 and Monaco75.

It seems like some of the GPC-tracks have pretty low grip levels and some don´t. The cars work really well at tracks as Kyalami75, Nurburg75 and Silverstone 79 (to mention a couple of examples), but not as well at tracks with low grip levels as Monza75/79 and Monaco75.

On the other hand is it possible to push the cars around MonteCarlo_88, (albeit they are a bit too slow there too), and it´s an awesome feeling to come out of the Casino in Ronnie´s Loti72 with a big power slide on your way down to the right hander before the Loews hairpin...End of Quote
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If you think that this sounds interesting and like a bit of fun you can find the links to the downloads of the Mod and the fix at the bottom of this post.

Please read the whole ReadMe for some more information about the cars performance and their engines, the Upgrades, the Credit List and how to Install this F1-75 Mod

Constructive feedback would be much appreciated as this is a Beta/Work in progress. I´m very open minded about all suggestions that could improve this mod.

Have fun!
--------------

Cheers
/JC

Released on: 092112
Current Version: V.0.96
File Size: 637.38 MB

DOWNLOAD

Comments:F1-75_V.0.96_Full_Install.rar

Att: You will have to remove the F1-Seven folder from your Vehicles folder if you already have got the F1-Seven Full88 Mod installed as this is a "Stand Alone" mod with a whole lot of new files and stuff. I think that the rFm files will be overwritten, but you might want to remove those two files too.

DOWNLOAD

Comments:F1-75_Upgrades_HillMirrors_Fix.rar

I noticed that rFactor for some reason didn´t "read in" the first entry among the Upgrades, Force Feedback Settings. I tried to solve the problem in all kinds of way but nothing seamed to work. I eventually had to solve the problem by making a "dummy" entry, "Nothing", which contains.. nothing.. it´s just there to get the 3 real Upgrades to work.

DOWNLOAD

Comments:F1-75 GenFilesFix.rar

These files fixes the flashing/blinking problem with cars in the outside view. They will also put the drivers in the car and get rid of those ugly chicks on the Spinner.

DOWNLOAD

Comments: F1-75_New_Sounds.rar.

New sound files (sfx) and the old ones as backup.
Use this Download if you already have got the GP79 Mod installed.

DOWNLOAD

Comments: F1-75_New_Sounds_GP79_SoundFiles.rar.

New sound files (sfx) and the old ones as backup, plus the GP79 Sound Files.
Use this Download if you haven´t got the GP79 Mod installed.

Last edited by J.C.Case on 28 Dec 2009, 01:45, edited 5 times in total.

[J.C.Case]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by J.C.Case » 21 Dec 2009, 11:26

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Here´s a F1-75_TrackPack containing 17 updated 1975 tracks.

File size: 258.42 MB
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=8RX1U5V6

I would suggest that you use Osterrichring70 and Zandvoort67, (which can be found here at Calluster´s Download section under European Tracks), instead of Osterreichring75 and Zandvort75 in this trackpack. as they contain a lot of strange bumps and stuff and aren´t very nice to drive.

Osterrichring70 and Zandvoort67 on the other hand are not only nice to drive, they are very well done too.
..................
And now to some miscellaneous stuff.

I´ve uploaded a video of the Formula 1 season 1975 for you, figuring that you might appreciate to see the real cars and drivers in action too. You can find it here:

The Grand Prix Collection - 1975
File size: 697.48 MB
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=GW9QECH7
---------

Cheers
/JC

[Luka K.]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by Luka K. » 21 Dec 2009, 12:18

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nice stuff j.c!!!

what do yo think people about some funraces next tweek?

btw are th etaracks in the trackpack original 75 tracks?

[J.C.Case]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by J.C.Case » 21 Dec 2009, 13:16

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Yeah, I think so.

They are based on the Gpc 79 tracks according to the ReadMe and have 75 graphics. Most of them are very nice to drive too, except for those two tracks that I mentioned above.

The chicane at Silverstone75 is missing though, they actually started to use that one already in 1975 but one can use Silverstone79 instead which has that chicane included.
-----

Cheers
/JC

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by -LuckyStrike- » 21 Dec 2009, 17:37

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I'm in if there is any fun race with those cars !

[GX7RAY]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by GX7RAY » 22 Dec 2009, 01:05

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This mod brings on Tyrrel P34 ,a mythical car that can not fail in any rfactor.

Thanks you J.C.Case share this mod.

[Kiro]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by Kiro » 22 Dec 2009, 07:30

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Loving it so far.
CarFactory can't read the hdv files.
Anybody know the slip angle for the front tires?
Need it for Leos.
I don't have a formula for getting it from the tbc.

[J.C.Case]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by J.C.Case » 23 Dec 2009, 01:18

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I don´t use Leo´s plugin, but I would like to try it sometime though. I never really understood how to set it up and stuff.

Here´s my Real Feel settings (Logi DFGT), if you or anybody else would like to try them. A bit light perhaps, but I can´t seem to do those fast corrections that I need to if the FFB strength is to high. Feels nice though.

[1975]
MaxForceAtSteeringRack=-1900.000000
SteeringDamper=11500.000000
FFBMixerRealFeelPercent=40.000000
SmoothingLevel=5
---------

Cheers
/JC

[Bob van Ingen]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by Bob van Ingen » 24 Dec 2009, 03:47

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nice movie! Seen it before, but loved seeing it again! Thx!

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by Sulla » 25 Dec 2009, 23:50

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Really like the mod...it's fun to drive on your own...that's one big thumbs up to start with. You can get sideways alot without the car just letting go that's fun. I didn't play with the setup much and the car seemed fast out of the box ...another plus. Personally i'd like to see the setup options limited.

The upgrades setion has a shifter pattern option. I used the H pattern shifter upgrade and had auto clutch turned off and had no problems whatsoever despite just using my game pad and buttons to shift gear. Kinda makes that upgrade a waste of time.

Overall i thought it was great....obviously needs sounds and some of the surface textures could be better but thats low on my list to do's.

[silvastone]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by silvastone » 26 Dec 2009, 00:57

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yes, new sounds sounds good!

[chris jansson]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by chris jansson » 26 Dec 2009, 01:05

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I had fun, I ran a lot of laps to be frank, didnt get bored.

A bit of a learning curve at first, 79 driving style comes back in an instant which had lower torque at lower revs, while these cars seem quicker so it took a few laps to get the hang of that. After a while it was ok to semi drift a bit, but not as much as in F167.


The point of the H shifter upgrade is to remove the shifting delay for those driving with a stick, since the actual delay is in moving the physical stick as opposed to using paddles. This is some what of a problem, its up to every driver to honor the meaning of the upgrades, not having the physical gear shift delay (moving the stick) nor the virtual delay (the game) when shifting makes the gearing instant.

So its not there to make it harder for paddle drivers, but to equal the playing field a bit between H and paddle shifters. I think the 2 pedal expert upgrade is what you are seeking Sulla, it behaves in such a way that you have to lift and blip when shifting using paddles.

[J.C.Case]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by J.C.Case » 26 Dec 2009, 17:22

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Thanks for the good reviews, it´s really nice to know that you like the physics of the cars, and it gives me the motivation to try to solve those on-line issues that appeared yesterday.

The problem there is that I don´t have a clue where to start so to speak. I don´t know anything about netcodes and stuff, and I could really use some help here so the F1-75 Mod can be driven on-line too.

I´ll try to learn. but as I said I´m totally in the dark here.
...
The setup options are quite limited already, Sulla. The wings, camber and suspension setting among other things, but I left a pretty big "window" for spring rate and a couple of other things.

The intention is to limit the setup options a bit more though with the next "big" update.
.......
Same thing about the shifter options which I´m not really satisfied with. As Chris already said, "the point of the H shifter upgrade is to remove the shifting delay for those driving with a stick, since the actual delay is in moving the physical stick as opposed to using paddles."

"So its not there to make it harder for paddle drivers, but to equal the playing field a bit between H and paddle shifters. I think the 2 pedal expert upgrade is what you are seeking Sulla, it behaves in such a way that you have to lift and blip when shifting using paddles."

I think that the second and third (paddle) shifter Upgrades might be a little bit to fast too (compeered to those who actually uses clutch and a H-shifter), but when I tried to use clutch delays (too) it made them Upgrades nearly undrivebul for me.

You should´t be punished for driving in the "Historically Correct" way, but the paddle shifter upgrades must be drivebul too. We could perhaps do some testing there to try to find a solution that works for everyone, as the mod is meant to be for everyone, regardless of which kind of pedal and shifter systems they use.
.........
The F1-Seven Full88 uses F1-88 sounds (originally GP79?) but as I nearly became death using them when I made the new physics, I changed to the F1-88LE sounds which are a bit more lenient to the ears, but perhaps a bit too lenient now..

So I´ve been working on using other sounds and I have a couple of alternatives nearly ready for test, the first one uses the F1-88 sounds mentioned above (slightly modified), and the second uses Callusters Aurora sounds.

I´ve got a bit of more work to do there, but I should (hopefully) have them ready for test in a couple of days. The Aurora sounds are really nice.
-----------------------------
I found these Gen files which fixes the flashing/blinking problem with cars in the outside view, the problem with disappearing body part in In-Car view in the AI/other players cars still remains though.

They will also put the drivers in the car and get rid of those ugly chicks on the Spinner.
....
The files are originally made by [VtCL]tatinos and 1LeSvT so Credit to them. I´ve just modified them a bit (the McLaren.gen quite extensively) to suit the F1-75 mod, and then repacked the files for easy installation.

Download:
F1-75 GenFilesFix.rar
http://www.megaupload.com/?d=ZYF2W7IM

Edit: I have updated the first post to include this Update too
......................
I´m sorry for the on-line issues that accured yesterday evening, but I will try to solve them. But as I stated above, I don´t know anything about netcodes and stuff, and I could really use some help here so the F1-75 Mod can be driven on-line too.

---------
Cheers
/JC

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by Sulla » 26 Dec 2009, 20:02

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Well it might be up to drivers to honour whatever...my point was this....it's quicker using the H pattern and having auto clutch turned off. I wasn't blipping at all...except for the shift to 1st for the hairpin. The big difference in performance was the fact that i didn't have the game blipping me...pushing me on a bit. So long as it's faster..people will use it...so...why have it.

Just like the 1985 mod...the H pattern was faster...apparently using things like auto clutch and paddle shifter upgrades carries a penalty ....to reward those that use the stick shifts and three pedals but it worked fine using paddles and no clutch whatsoever...so people used it. The point was using the sequential shift option caused your rear wheels to lock a lot under braking and also caused the engine to push you along with every blip thus increasing your braking distance. So in that mod...yes it did penalise the people who honoured it. I got the same feeing with this mod.

It doesn't matter at all about people honouring this that or the other...not only is it faster...but it feels better...much nicer infact to use that upgrade regardless of it maybe making faster changes. I'll use the H pattern for that reason alone.

So once everyone knows this...and the paddle shifters and the stick shifters are all using that upgrade....kinda makes the rest a waste of code. Rewarding people who use a stick will never work...because in the end it just means you're slower without a stick shift. There was more to the 1985 mods querks than just that upgrade but in the end no one wanted to race those cars because unless you used a certain config of plr and upgardes you didn't stand a chance. Now both JC and Chris say it's not about penalising paddle shifters....but it does. Maybe you didn't mean to make the H pattern upgrade faster....but it is.

You said it all JC when you said that you shouldn't be punished for driving in the histroically right way....what does that mean....shouldn't be punished...so you must be saying that paddles are by default faster and therefore they should be penalised to allow people using the historically right way to compete.

Hunt said something about a league that had these issues and so just made a certain upgrade setting mandatory.

I like the mod a lot...just like Chris said we all did a lot of laps of practice just for fun.....says a lot in itself.

[J.C.Case]

Re: F1-75 - New Physics

by J.C.Case » 26 Dec 2009, 23:58

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Well, first of all it means that I´m a little bit bad at expressing myself in English, I guess that came out a bit more hash then it was supposed to, but all and all I stand for that.

I think that paddle drivers should n´ be using an Option that is meant to equalize things between them and the guy´s that uses clutch, H-shifter and toe heel technique which in itself are a slower way to shift.

But I guess it´s the same old story as with most stuff in this world, when people get a chance to get an advantage on others they take it, which doesn´t mean that they are right in doing so, which you seam to say.

This reminds me very much about the Gpl shifter thingy, but in that case it was the paddle shifters that was protesting because the H-shifter user had an "unfair" advantage, some even called us cheaters.

And they were actually right to some degree, there was those who used the Act-Labs* software to disable neutral time which gave them the opportunity to shift gears without any delay at all, a bit like the paddle shifters who are using the H-shift Option in rFactor do..

Having said that, I will NOT go so far as calling what you and other paddle users do when using the H-shift Option for cheating, I do NOT think that and even if I had, it´s not for me to tell (right word?) Judgment over anyways.

That is for those who arrange leagues AND impose a rule that forbids it, or perhaps for those who administrate a WR site (ex Gpl-Rank) which uses such a rule.

Me, I´m just want to have as much fun driving as I can and for me that is to use toe-heel and a shifter and if that means that I´m going to lose out time wise.. So what, this is how I have chosen to drive. And I don´t really care what other people do as long as they have fun and don´t break the rules of the league that I participate in.

I would prefer if "every driver honor the meaning of the upgrades" just like Chris do, but I´m not here to tell judgment or trying to impose what I believe is right.
....
That might sound like a bit of a contradiction to what I said in the first part of this post, but it really isn´t. That is what I believe is right, but I´m not going to say to you or any other bloke here what to do or not to do. As I said that´s not up to me to do, but you wanted to know my thought´s about it and now you do.

I really don´t want to go any further with this discussion then this, mate. It will (probably) just lead to a lot of argumentation and as I´m not going to change my mind on this and I guess you wont either, it´s kind of pointless to continue.

I answered you now in this thread out of respect for you, mate, but I would really appreciate if you or anybody else who want´s to continue this discussion started a new Thread instead for that purpose, as this thread is supposed to be about the F1-75 Mod.
-----
Cheers
/JC


*I for one (who was left foot braking in those days, toe-heeling now) used the Gpl-shift proggie which doesn´t allow you to disable Neutral and I never speedshifted, always lifted the throttle on upshifts. On top of that I never ever uploaded a WR where I had gained/lost less speed compared to the paddle shifters during shifts (you can see that with GPLRA).

I didn´t do this because other people wanted me to though, it was because I didn´t want to have an advantage. But some people still said that I was cheating anyway (by not using paddles), and telling them to compare the speeds lost during shifting didn´t get them of my back anyway..

Well, what can you do..